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2025-10-26 19:58:20 <int-e> (I'm not a `stack` user)
2025-10-26 19:58:51 <omentic> okay i see so the lts-22.30 resolver is where packages are coming from...
2025-10-26 19:59:21 <int-e> (But I regularly overflow stacks, so I'm a stack user.)
2025-10-26 19:59:26 <monochrom> Yeah stack default behaviour is you say which resolver and stack sticks to it.
2025-10-26 20:00:11 <omentic> what
2025-10-26 20:00:29 <omentic> (oops, sorry) what's stackage wrt. hackage?
2025-10-26 20:02:09 <davean> Its a specific set of packages from hackage.
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2025-10-26 20:05:06 <davean> omentic: it gives you 0 or 1 versions of the packages on hackage.
2025-10-26 20:05:15 trickard_ is now known as trickard
2025-10-26 20:05:19 <omentic> i see it's meant to be stable but i'm not sure what that means. what makes something that is *not* based on stackage unstable? what's wrong with specifying specific versions of your dependencies?
2025-10-26 20:05:40 <davean> What it means is that if you don't set your version bounds you still get the sameish thing over time
2025-10-26 20:05:57 <davean> Ah, apparently specifying versions is REALLY REALLY hard and confusing.
2025-10-26 20:06:19 <davean> So you can ahve an entire system that means you don't have to because there aren't options :-p
2025-10-26 20:06:41 <omentic> hm, interesting... do you know why specifying versions is hard?
2025-10-26 20:06:57 <davean> I have no fucking clue man, I've never understood. People get really upset about it though
2025-10-26 20:07:01 <monochrom> s/stable/conservative/ would be more accurate IMO
2025-10-26 20:07:55 <davean> IMO it makes it much harder, because as soon as you need something else you've broken the entire model
2025-10-26 20:08:34 <davean> Well I guess i know one thing people find confusing about versions, and thats that they don't understand constraint solvers so they're mystified by the constraitn conflicts cabal spits out apparently?
2025-10-26 20:08:52 <davean> Though thats the same idea as a type system so I don't get why they're confused about that if they're using Haskell.
2025-10-26 20:09:03 <int-e> I think the intent is that if your software had a build plan and worked with LTS-20.1 then it will still compile and work with LTS-20.26, thanks to curation (with strong reliance on the package versioning policy)
2025-10-26 20:09:28 <davean> int-e: right but you get that with package versioning to start with
2025-10-26 20:10:27 <omentic> davean: hm, i was a little mystified honestly. i saw one bound i had specified (pandoc >= 3.8) but stack inserted another bound (pandoc < 3.9) and didn't tell me where it came from, and also did not consider versions i thought it should consider and didn't tell me why
2025-10-26 20:10:52 <omentic> turns out that < 3.9 bound is just because pandoc >= 3.9 does not exist lmfao
2025-10-26 20:11:18 <omentic> and turns out the didn't-consider-versions issue was my resolver. but i wish it told me these things.
2025-10-26 20:12:05 <int-e> omentic: hmm, are you sure it's not just restricting it to a single major release? It's effectively 3.8.*
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2025-10-26 20:12:36 <omentic> int-e: oh, you're absolutely right, my bad
2025-10-26 20:13:13 <omentic> yeah i got that output mixed up with when i was trying to use >= instead of * debugging the resolver issue
2025-10-26 20:13:24 <omentic> stack slander revoked
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2025-10-26 20:18:42 <omentic> how long does it usually take for a hackage package to get in a stackage LTS?
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2025-10-26 20:21:07 <davean> omentic: its not even a time thing
2025-10-26 20:21:22 <davean> If it had more than one option I think it might lend its self more to a time thing
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2025-10-26 22:07:26 <haskellbridge> <sm> omentic a quick read of the stack docs would make things a lot clearer ?
2025-10-26 22:07:31 <haskellbridge> <sm> (hopefully..)
2025-10-26 22:08:21 <haskellbridge> <sm> https://stackage.org is the essential page, here you can see what snapshots exist and what package versions are in each
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2025-10-26 22:11:42 <haskellbridge> <sm> stackage is "stable hackage". If you're familiar with Debian, stackage is to hackage as debian is to github, roughly. It provides a set of snapshots of known-compatible packages from the continually-updated hackage.
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2025-10-26 22:16:10 <haskellbridge> <sm> a new release on hackage appears automatically in the next stackage nightly (if it is configured there and builds there). A new lts is cut from the current nightly every so often (depends eg on ghc releases). Also lts snapshots get updated.
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