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2025-10-26 22:22:57 merijn joins (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl)
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2025-10-26 22:27:59 <haskellbridge> <sm> If you wonder why known-compatible snapshots are needed, given that all hackage packages specify compatibility bounds: a package's bounds aren't always correct or accurate; they can change at any time; and cabal's dynamic solving of them can, too. A snapshot provides more reproducibility. It's also a natural place to do extra quality control, or to start other packaging efforts.
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2025-10-26 22:30:28 <c_wraith> Stack has mostly stopped telling its users to make hackage worse for everybody, so I don't dislike it as much as I used to. But it still doesn't fix any problem I actually have.
2025-10-26 22:31:23 <sm> stack never did that
2025-10-26 22:32:14 <c_wraith> yes, it did. There was a specific recommendation to not put upper bounds on package dependencies
2025-10-26 22:32:20 <c_wraith> Which broke a lot of things
2025-10-26 22:32:24 <sm> do show us, please :)
2025-10-26 22:32:42 <c_wraith> I lived through it. As a victim.
2025-10-26 22:32:45 <sm> ah I take it back, it's not that important.
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2025-10-26 22:34:27 <geekosaur> it broke a lot of people back when that was the recommendation
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2025-10-26 22:41:04 <davean> Yah, https://www.snoyman.com/blog/2017/01/stackage-design-choices/ has some oblique references to the policy
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2025-10-26 22:42:48 <davean> snoyman was pretty agresive on it.
2025-10-26 22:43:00 <davean> Not as agressive as https://web.archive.org/web/20191122170832/https://twitter.com/haskdev/status/820932892385808384 mind you
2025-10-26 22:44:11 <davean> Sadly, a LOT of it was on twitter, or in private email, and twitter is very hard to cite these days.
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2025-10-26 22:50:43 <EvanR> I wonder if there's a utility to archive (locally) all of your twitter account...
2025-10-26 22:50:50 <EvanR> and convert it into another form
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2025-10-27 00:13:53 <jackdk> sm: I had to make revisions to 25 `http-conduit` releases because none of them had upper bounds on their `aeson` deps. Snoyman, though stack, definitely preached and practiced "no-upper-bounds". `stack new`still generates templates like `base >= 4.7 && <5`, which admits new `base` releases that are allowed to break backwards-compatibility.
2025-10-27 00:17:17 <haskellbridge> <sm> I believe stack never "told its users to make hackage worse for everybody". Blog posts and interpretations at some point in time are a different matter, if you want to cite we could discuss, but it's not that important now is it
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2025-10-27 00:17:48 <haskellbridge> <sm> and bravo for revising past releases. (I usually don't go that far back)
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2025-10-27 00:20:48 <L29Ah> stack users still upload packages to hackage with synopsis made of "hackage docs suck go to stackage"
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2025-10-27 00:24:05 <haskellbridge> <sm> ok what fresh hell is this.. show us please L29Ah :)
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2025-10-27 00:27:29 <jackdk> https://hackage.haskell.org/package/conduit-1.3.6.1 is one example: "Hackage documentation generation is not reliable. For up to date documentation, please see: http://www.stackage.org/package/conduit". It's not in the templates that `stack new` generates today, AFAICT but it takes time for existing projects to change
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2025-10-27 00:29:21 <haskellbridge> <sm> I don't see a problem here, YMMMV
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2025-10-27 00:32:28 <L29Ah> ok i admit it is probably just a personal gimmick, and i'm just seeing those packages very often // https://hackage.haskell.org/package/http-client
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2025-10-27 00:49:07 <geekosaur> people still think cabal is in its v1 days
2025-10-27 00:49:25 <geekosaur> and hackage did at one point have problems building docs, but that was fixed like a decade ago
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2025-10-27 01:00:03 <c_wraith> hackage still won't build docs if the package depends on a library that isn't (or can't be) installed. But it supports uploading docs for that situation.
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2025-10-27 01:04:11 <geekosaur> right, but there was a time when it was failing for all packages
2025-10-27 01:04:15 <geekosaur> lasted a couple years
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