Logs: freenode/#haskell
| 2021-04-25 15:39:20 | <maerwald> | just because python provides lambda syntax doesn't make it a functional programming language |
| 2021-04-25 15:39:34 | → | Alleria_ joins (~textual@mskresolve-a.mskcc.org) |
| 2021-04-25 15:39:54 | <ammar2> | where would you put something like scala |
| 2021-04-25 15:39:57 | <hpc> | mostly because python's lambdas are an embarassment |
| 2021-04-25 15:39:58 | <gnumonic> | isn't there like, some kind of graph reduction calculus that you could use instead of the lambda calculus? |
| 2021-04-25 15:40:05 | <__minoru__shirae> | there is something resembling ownership going on in ST monad |
| 2021-04-25 15:40:05 | <gnumonic> | where it'd basically be functional |
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| 2021-04-25 15:40:16 | <maerwald> | ammar2: I haven't had a look at Scala and its specification, so I don't know |
| 2021-04-25 15:40:19 | <hpc> | ruby would be a better example, and i would say it has enough emphasis on functions to count as functional |
| 2021-04-25 15:40:20 | <DigitalKiwi> | http://www.ats-lang.org/ > rust amirite |
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| 2021-04-25 15:40:40 | <hpc> | even if it's in such a chaotic way that it makes lisp macros look normal by comparison |
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| 2021-04-25 15:41:40 | <DigitalKiwi> | ammar2: the garbage bin |
| 2021-04-25 15:41:55 | <maerwald> | lol |
| 2021-04-25 15:42:19 | <ammar2> | sure but that's beyond the point |
| 2021-04-25 15:44:21 | <gnumonic> | lambdas in python are weird. i tried to learn a bit of it and... do they not capture the scope or something? i just remember them not doing what you'd expect |
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| 2021-04-25 15:44:50 | <maerwald> | ammar2: some sources say scala is based on lambda calculus |
| 2021-04-25 15:44:51 | <hpc> | gnumonic: scope and that you can't do "statements" with them, only simple expressions |
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| 2021-04-25 15:45:22 | <hpc> | but scope's a mess in python anyway, since variables are declared implicitly |
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| 2021-04-25 15:45:31 | <DigitalKiwi> | ammar2: narrowing the point; depends are you using scalaz or not |
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| 2021-04-25 15:46:07 | <ammar2> | so it's not a property of the language then? |
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| 2021-04-25 15:46:17 | <ammar2> | what does it matter what it's based on? |
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| 2021-04-25 15:46:59 | <gnumonic> | tbh i found python very confusing coming from a haskell background. i know it's supposed to be easy to learn but rust has been a lot smoother |
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| 2021-04-25 15:48:53 | <__minoru__shirae> | DigitalKiwi: it's not clear whether you approve of scalaz or not |
| 2021-04-25 15:50:45 | <maerwald> | ammar2: what do you mean? |
| 2021-04-25 15:50:50 | <DigitalKiwi> | i love scalaz if it wasn't for scalaz i'd still be using scala and not haskell ;) |
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| 2021-04-25 15:51:15 | <DigitalKiwi> | <3 dibblego |
| 2021-04-25 15:51:39 | <maerwald> | That's the only reasonable definition. All others are about how a language feels to you. That may be important, but is hard to argue about. |
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| 2021-04-25 15:55:59 | <__minoru__shirae> | so scalaz is bad? I got the impression that scalaz and cats are trying to port haskell to scala |
| 2021-04-25 15:56:26 | <__minoru__shirae> | I mean, to make it possible to write in scala like in haskell |
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| 2021-04-25 15:58:09 | <DigitalKiwi> | no, scalaz is good, if you're writing scala. |
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| 2021-04-25 15:59:28 | <DigitalKiwi> | scala as oderksy intends it is extremely anti-fp |
| 2021-04-25 16:00:29 | <DigitalKiwi> | https://twitter.com/ArchKiwi/status/1069358576551034885 |
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| 2021-04-25 16:04:21 | <__minoru__shirae> | that's actually one of the reasons why I started learning haskell: I used to see occasional mentions of scalaz and cats here and there and decided to start from haskell |
| 2021-04-25 16:04:40 | <__minoru__shirae> | and now I'm too deep in haskell and don't want to come back to scala |
| 2021-04-25 16:07:11 | <DigitalKiwi> | __minoru__shirae: i used scalaz for years and when i'd ask questions about things i didn't understand dibblego would say to learn haskell which was frustrating because i was not working on a haskell codebase so this seems like it would not help me solve my immediate problem to learn a different language...turns out learning haskell made all of the things i didn't understand make sense ;) (and then ultimately meant i was able to switch to haskel |
| 2021-04-25 16:07:11 | <DigitalKiwi> | l instead of scala too so) |
| 2021-04-25 16:08:53 | <DigitalKiwi> | really it made a lot of things in other languages make more sense too. ex. python list comprehensions |
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| 2021-04-25 16:36:36 | <HelplessProgramm> | Hello again |
| 2021-04-25 16:36:43 | <HelplessProgramm> | I'm progressing better now |
| 2021-04-25 16:36:51 | <HelplessProgramm> | I have a small doubt |
| 2021-04-25 16:37:07 | <HelplessProgramm> | I have a function such as foo :: Int -> Int -> Int |
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| 2021-04-25 16:37:15 | <HelplessProgramm> | And 2 lists of ints |
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| 2021-04-25 16:37:48 | <HelplessProgramm> | How could i make it so i run all permutations of the function with the elements of the 2 lists? |
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| 2021-04-25 16:38:11 | <HelplessProgramm> | I tried map but it only takes one argument |
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| 2021-04-25 16:39:42 | <hpc> | check out Applicative |
| 2021-04-25 16:39:49 | <HelplessProgramm> | Oh god |
| 2021-04-25 16:39:53 | <HelplessProgramm> | That makes my brain hurt |
| 2021-04-25 16:40:37 | <hpc> | as you learn it, remember foo <$> firstList <*> secondList |
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