Logs: freenode/#haskell
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| 2021-04-13 20:40:03 | <hololeap> | is there a name for this: "if not A then B" does not imply "if A then not B" |
| 2021-04-13 20:40:17 | <hololeap> | in logic |
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| 2021-04-13 20:42:11 | <pjb> | Contraposition |
| 2021-04-13 20:42:14 | <pjb> | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contraposition |
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| 2021-04-13 20:44:23 | <hololeap> | it sounds like contraposition is: "if A then B" _does_ imply "if not A then not B" |
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| 2021-04-13 20:45:53 | <int-e> | hololeap: no, for contraposition you need to swap A and B in one of those implications |
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| 2021-04-13 20:46:19 | <hololeap> | i know, i'm saying what i asked for is not contraposition, but does it have a name? some fallacy name perhaps? |
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| 2021-04-13 20:48:03 | <int-e> | hololeap: I'd go with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denying_the_antecedent |
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| 2021-04-13 20:51:08 | <int-e> | well, under most circumstances I would just say that it's illogical and not try to name it at all; it seems more useful to point out a counterexample (the implication fails if A and B both true) |
| 2021-04-13 20:51:52 | <hololeap> | hm, ok. just want to throw an example out there, since i don't see exactly what i'm looking for on that page, although it might be the correct term: "if you don't do your chores, you will die" does not imply "if you do your chores, you will _not_ die" |
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| 2021-04-13 20:52:31 | <hololeap> | so if someone argues that the former does imply the latter, is that denying the antecedent? |
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| 2021-04-13 20:56:36 | <monochrom> | hololeap: Under classical logic, "if not A then not B" is the same as "if B then A", and both are the converse of "if A then B". |
| 2021-04-13 20:57:07 | <monochrom> | Under intuitionistic logic, I think I am not so sure which one is still the converse. |
| 2021-04-13 20:57:16 | <monochrom> | (but one of them has to be) |
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| 2021-04-13 20:58:50 | <monochrom> | But also, on top of classical logic, people also add a closed-world or induction meta-rule. Sometimes. |
| 2021-04-13 21:00:11 | <monochrom> | So when they say "if you don't do this, you'll die", and perhaps adding a few more similar rules, they also have an implicit "these are the only ways to get you to die", like in Prolog and inductive definitions. |
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| 2021-04-13 21:00:51 | <dolio> | Well, that's a good example, because you're going to die regardless. |
| 2021-04-13 21:01:04 | <monochrom> | To be sure, when they decide to blackmail you with "if you don't give me $10000 I'll post your pics", yeah, after you give $10000 they will just ask for more. |
| 2021-04-13 21:01:04 | <dolio> | Just a matter of when. |
| 2021-04-13 21:01:28 | <monochrom> | Conclusion: Only mathematicians and blackmailers are true clasical logicians. >:) |
| 2021-04-13 21:02:40 | <juri_> | monochrom: never forget the first rule of crime: never cost anyone more than it would cost to have you killed. |
| 2021-04-13 21:03:11 | <monochrom> | That's also a rule of good business. >:) |
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| 2021-04-13 21:03:49 | <juri_> | the two branches are part of the same field. |
| 2021-04-13 21:03:54 | <monochrom> | The authors of Freakonomics would be proud. >:) |
| 2021-04-13 21:04:07 | <koz_> | Crime is just business by other means. :P |
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| 2021-04-13 21:05:51 | <hpc> | sufficiently advanced monetization |
| 2021-04-13 21:07:19 | <juri_> | insufficiently advanced monetization is called 'bitcoin'. |
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| 2021-04-13 21:42:09 | <maerwald> | are mixed path separators allowed on windows, e.g. "/path/to\\file"? |
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| 2021-04-13 22:00:02 | <DigitalKiwi> | juri_: are you saying bitcoin should be 1million? |
| 2021-04-13 22:03:48 | <int-e> | DigitalKiwi: sufficiently advanced monetization requires a lot less electricity |
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| 2021-04-13 22:06:17 | <DigitalKiwi> | nobody would buy it then though! |
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