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Logs: liberachat/#xmonad

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2021-11-14 16:33:34 <geekosaur> yeh, the combinator is an all-in-one solution
2021-11-14 16:33:47 <geekosaur> and now you need xmobar configured with a StdinReader
2021-11-14 16:34:23 <geekosaur> otherwise the pipe will eventually fill up and xmonad will block. (0.17.0 provides a different setup based on X properties, which won't block)
2021-11-14 16:34:45 <noex> oh really
2021-11-14 16:35:13 <noex> woah, yeah mine is pretty outdated
2021-11-14 16:35:15 <noex> wth
2021-11-14 16:35:29 <geekosaur> that's why I pointed to X.H.StatusBar earlier. it's a somewhat easier configuration that uses properties instead of pipes, so it behaves somewhat better
2021-11-14 16:35:43 <noex> apparently gentoo provides 0.15
2021-11-14 16:36:01 <geekosaur> hm, thought they'd upgraded :(
2021-11-14 16:36:09 <geekosaur> 0.17.0 was only released a week ago
2021-11-14 16:36:22 <noex> might be a pr for it. i'll yell about it :)
2021-11-14 16:36:25 <geekosaur> guess you would have to get it from hackage
2021-11-14 16:37:11 <geekosaur> well, it's not uncommon that distributions take their cue from stackage. and stackage is blocked on updates because of recent ghc upgrades (nightly is not yet usable, so no new LTS)
2021-11-14 16:37:43 <noex> ahh yeah, i tried to build ghc from source for a school project and they had other outdated packages I noticed
2021-11-14 16:38:27 <noex> i should really support this project monetarily. xmonad is the most important tool i have. i would really hate to have to use anything else.
2021-11-14 16:39:06 <noex> i'm totally sponsoring this project on gh
2021-11-14 16:39:18 <geekosaur> hm, stackage nightly still on 9.0.1. which a lot of folks are skipping because 9.0.1 is buggy :(
2021-11-14 16:39:38 <geekosaur> this seems a bit counterproductive
2021-11-14 16:40:25 <geekosaur> in particular few packages intend to update for compatibility until either 9.0.2 comes out or stackage commits to 9.2.1
2021-11-14 16:41:20 <noex> i know at work i had to set everything up using cabal because RHEL and CentOS didn't provide xmonad for version 8 yet
2021-11-14 16:41:28 <noex> probably had much newer packages than other distros that way
2021-11-14 16:42:11 <noex> and by that i mean EPEL
2021-11-14 16:42:16 <obimod> <3 xmonad
2021-11-14 16:42:16 <geekosaur> at least nightly now has 0.17.0
2021-11-14 16:42:35 <obimod> so much better than any other window manager i've used
2021-11-14 16:43:12 <noex> it really is the greatest
2021-11-14 16:43:36 <noex> when i had a mac at work, i found some plugin to make it attempt to behave like xmonad, but it wasn't the same at all
2021-11-14 16:46:17 <geekosaur> apple makes it really difficult to do that :(
2021-11-14 16:47:07 <geekosaur> there have been several attempts, including at least one attempted port of xmonad itself, but apple doesn't provide enough hooks and they randomly change stuff whenever they feel like it
2021-11-14 16:47:49 <geekosaur> (hm, was osxmonad a port or a rewrite? don't recall any more)
2021-11-14 16:48:05 <obimod> there's amethyst
2021-11-14 16:48:19 <obimod> it has improved but you can tell something at the core cannot be done
2021-11-14 16:48:25 <obimod> osx windows are just too heavy imo
2021-11-14 16:48:31 <obimod> at least that's how it feels
2021-11-14 16:48:44 <noex> i used something called Amethyst. I applaud the dev's efforts, but yeah...just not the same
2021-11-14 16:48:55 <obimod> and by osx windows i mean osx windowing management
2021-11-14 16:49:02 <geekosaur> they work completely differently from x11 windows
2021-11-14 16:49:27 <obimod> xmonad is like community college, it's just what you need
2021-11-14 16:49:33 <geekosaur> and libapplewm provides too few hooks, in part because too much is controlled by the window itself in the apple model
2021-11-14 16:49:34 <obimod> a (good) community college :)
2021-11-14 16:49:50 <geekosaur> (and the windows model, for that matter, which is why nobody's tried to port xmonad to windows)
2021-11-14 16:52:33 alternateved joins (~user@staticline-31-183-149-3.toya.net.pl)
2021-11-14 16:52:40 <noex> oh windows
2021-11-14 16:53:08 <noex> :)
2021-11-14 16:53:37 <geekosaur> like, you can't make the titlebar and buttons go away because they're rendered by the application (toolkit), not the system
2021-11-14 16:54:22 <geekosaur> which makes them more flexible for the application but means you can't really do "minimalist"
2021-11-14 16:58:06 <noex> yeah the word "minimalist" doesn't seem to be in microsoft's vocabulary
2021-11-14 16:59:39 <noex> i had to automate some package installs at work and it was basically a game of "let's find which non-standard flag I need to pass this one to make it not pop up a gui"
2021-11-14 17:00:36 <noex> it just really seems to fight automation and simplicity
2021-11-14 17:03:32 <geekosaur> what I have never understood about mswindows is, how is microsoft itself not affected by this?
2021-11-14 17:03:59 <noex> lol
2021-11-14 17:04:00 <geekosaur> you'd think they would want to automate building things themselves, especially these days
2021-11-14 17:04:50 <noex> yeah, idk that's a good question. maybe some proprietary in-house tools
2021-11-14 17:06:42 <noex> the lack of thought that goes into some things is really mind blowing. i tried to embrace powershell remoting because it worked almost out of the box at work, until I realized they had not considered editing files. after googling extensively, the best solution I found is you have to basically just cat and echo into files.
2021-11-14 17:09:12 <geekosaur> well, I think in the older days they just did it once and made a system image they could slap around. but that doesn't scale to the cloud very well unless they've also reinvented something like docker — but mswindows doesn't make that easy either
2021-11-14 17:10:39 <obimod> i don't know haskell and i think i might be missing something obvious here; but xmobar is not instantiating multiple instances across screens. does anyone know what i'm missing? think the relevent config is here: https://dpaste.org/FSb2#L392,393,397,402
2021-11-14 17:16:07 × geekosaur quits (~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur) (Remote host closed the connection)
2021-11-14 17:16:32 geekosaur joins (~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur)
2021-11-14 17:19:27 <geekosaur> not seeing anything obviously wrong, unless xmobar needs the -x option before the config file
2021-11-14 17:19:54 <noex> mine is only on one screen as well, but I'm okay with that
2021-11-14 17:20:17 <noex> must be the default?
2021-11-14 17:20:46 <geekosaur> default is it places itself on screen 0. -x option lets you specify a screen
2021-11-14 17:23:26 <obimod> -x option on line 393 -- yea, this is definitely a nice to have. essentially procrastination from other things
2021-11-14 17:23:45 <obimod> i'm fine with it on only one screen
2021-11-14 17:24:07 <obimod> i did learn to send xmobar SIGUSR1 to change screens
2021-11-14 17:24:12 <obimod> that was nice
2021-11-14 17:25:13 <obimod> doesn't add the gap though, so when screens are changed if it wasn't the original screen it's hidden in the background
2021-11-14 17:25:45 <obimod> nice for fixing placement when i change from docked to undocked (screen 0 changes monitors)
2021-11-14 17:27:04 <geekosaur> I think that's a downside of the way we currently handle struts. what we do now is much faster than how it used to work (all the real work was in avoidStruts) but means strut changes can be missed
2021-11-14 17:28:38 <geekosaur> but I don't run xmobar and don't know it that well, so there are limits to how much I can help with it
2021-11-14 17:28:53 <obimod> ahh - i was wondering about those changes -- i do see avoidStruts but then we toggleStruts to add and remove the gap
2021-11-14 17:29:10 SenranKaguya joins (~weechat@c-73-15-19-170.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2021-11-14 17:29:12 <geekosaur> right, but it's when we *record* the struts that matters
2021-11-14 17:29:14 <obimod> i really appreciate the look over though geekosaur
2021-11-14 17:29:24 Guest44 joins (~Guest44@2603-6081-7700-dffb-800e-a94a-caeb-828d.res6.spectrum.com)
2021-11-14 17:29:40 <geekosaur> used to be we did it in avoidStruts, which as a result had to examine every window. this got slow with lots of windows
2021-11-14 17:30:05 <obimod> that makes sense
2021-11-14 17:30:06 <geekosaur> now we track what the docks are and record their struts, but that means we don't notice when their struts change, I think
2021-11-14 17:30:48 <obimod> sounds like a sensible trade off
2021-11-14 17:30:52 <geekosaur> (should be fixable by monitoring properties on strut-holding windows, come to think of it. you might file an issue about that)
2021-11-14 17:32:27 <geekosaur> mm, I thought maybe we already did that in docksEventHook but you have that
2021-11-14 17:34:49 <geekosaur> actually this seems a little weird because it's the case the old docksEventHook was specifically intended to handle, docks jumping screens. but I haven't kept track of how it has changed since the 0.12 rewrite
2021-11-14 17:38:20 <obimod> i dont think new docks are being setup for xmobar on any other screen than 0 -- i wonder if xmobar is missing some calls with regards to docking
2021-11-14 17:39:08 <obimod> for instance, i would expect the SIGUSR1 to jump the dock to the new screen
2021-11-14 17:39:22 <obimod> SIGUSR1 to xmobar that is
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2021-11-14 17:39:48 × noex quits (~noex@2600:8804:1280:aa0:5857:94a:25de:c513) (Quit: my dad's not a phone!)
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2021-11-14 17:40:22 <obimod> (assuming i am getting this terminology right)
2021-11-14 17:42:04 noex joins (~noex@2600:8804:1280:aa0:5857:94a:25de:c513)
2021-11-14 17:43:24 <obimod> i think by "gap" i mean "dock"
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2021-11-14 17:46:10 <obimod> i think i found the issue geekosaur https://github.com/jaor/xmobar/issues/541#issuecomment-835288052
2021-11-14 17:47:39 <geekosaur> so SIGUSR1 isn't working either? that suggests xmobar is missing multiscreen support or just doesn't detect the mmultiple screens, rather than the issue you pointed to
2021-11-14 17:48:15 <obimod> or maybe not, i'm using Top and not static - SIGUSR1 is working, but it's not creating the "gap" on the screen for some reason
2021-11-14 17:48:16 <geekosaur> or, I guess, Static simply doesn't work with multiscreen, which would be that issue I guess
2021-11-14 17:48:36 <obimod> my bad, that's not the issue
2021-11-14 17:49:07 <geekosaur> right, the gap is something else and that should be on xmonad side. but you have that issue plus the multiple spawns issue? or just one?
2021-11-14 17:49:54 <obimod> right, both issues
2021-11-14 17:50:53 <obimod> i've also added the xmobar config here: https://dpaste.org/D43b (below xmonad.hs) -- in case you were wondering

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