Logs: liberachat/#xmonad
| 2022-03-14 17:21:49 | <jimr> | k |
| 2022-03-14 17:23:13 | <jimr> | seems xmonad can be picky about spaces at times lol |
| 2022-03-14 17:23:38 | <geekosaur> | haskell is like python in being whitespace-sensitive |
| 2022-03-14 17:23:59 | <geekosaur> | although you can turn it off in haskell by using braces and semicolons instead |
| 2022-03-14 17:24:01 | <jimr> | good to know..since im going to teach my self python |
| 2022-03-14 17:24:25 | <geekosaur> | (that doesn't work in python though) |
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| 2022-03-14 17:35:48 | <Guest75> | Has there been any thoughts on a wayland effort recently? The waymonad independent effort seems to have been abandoned. Was that (wlroots based) implementation considered a good idea in retrospect from the people here? |
| 2022-03-14 17:47:56 | <geekosaur> | not really. we don't have any programmers who know wayland, and mostof us think wayland needs a few more years to mature |
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| 2022-03-14 17:48:52 | <geekosaur> | we may end up using our donation income to pay someone to write it |
| 2022-03-14 17:52:19 | <geekosaur> | https://github.com/L-as/waymonad README has some notes on the wlroots-based implementation's problems, but still seems to think it's the way to go. I don't know enough about wayland to say. |
| 2022-03-14 17:52:42 | <Guest75> | Agreed that it needs more time to mature. I've been considering learning the wayland protocol and wlroots in my spare time to get a feel for the level of effort needed. Was more curious if there were other ideas floating around |
| 2022-03-14 17:55:07 | <liskin> | There's the idea of keeping xmonad a window manager and having the compositor be a separate process, which I'm a big fan of and Las is against it. |
| 2022-03-14 17:56:33 | <Guest75> | Is there a summary of the arguments somewhere? |
| 2022-03-14 17:57:31 | <liskin> | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28797020 and the linked posts |
| 2022-03-14 17:57:35 | × | jimr quits (~jimr@2603-7080-7640-b000-0000-0000-0000-000c.res6.spectrum.com) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-03-14 17:57:58 | <Guest75> | tyvm |
| 2022-03-14 17:58:39 | <liskin> | Not sure if there's a summary of Las' argument but as I understand it it's mostly about being able to do visual/eye-candy stuff in Haskell. |
| 2022-03-14 17:59:28 | <geekosaur> | I have to admit that if you're looking for eye candy, xmonadis probably not what you shouldbe looking at :) |
| 2022-03-14 17:59:30 | <liskin> | Which is a meaningful goal but IMO not a good tradeoff for xmonad with the "minimal, fast, robust, stable" philosophy |
| 2022-03-14 17:59:47 | <liskin> | geekosaur: /r/unixporn would disagree |
| 2022-03-14 18:00:17 | <liskin> | xmonad's versatility can be abused to get eye candy :-) |
| 2022-03-14 18:00:45 | <Guest75> | without knowing too much about it yet, my concerns are with upkeeping the compositor part/limitations of tying ourselves to wlroots, which is ultimately whatever sway wants to support |
| 2022-03-14 18:01:46 | <geekosaur> | dunno, looks to me like they like xmonad staying out of the way of the real eye candy :) |
| 2022-03-14 18:02:20 | <liskin> | Coming up with a good enough compositor/window-manager protocol could help with both concerns, possibly. |
| 2022-03-14 18:02:44 | <geekosaur> | then again, I've never really gotten the point of desktop eye candy. I want it to help me focus on what I'm doing |
| 2022-03-14 18:11:45 | <liskin> | Yeah, same here, but it's a significant concern for some part of our user base so it's good keeping in mind I suppose |
| 2022-03-14 18:12:56 | <liskin> | People being willing to run picom with its horrible lags tells you something about this |
| 2022-03-14 18:13:18 | <liskin> | And there being more maintained forks of picom than of xmonad :-D |
| 2022-03-14 18:16:39 | <Guest75> | well picom has the amazing benefit of being able to be turned off when it gets in the way lol |
| 2022-03-14 18:17:32 | <liskin> | So does any other X11 compositor though |
| 2022-03-14 18:18:10 | <Guest75> | yes. I was taking shots at wayland |
| 2022-03-14 18:18:50 | <liskin> | I see :-) |
| 2022-03-14 18:22:15 | <geekosaur> | that's what I figured :) |
| 2022-03-14 18:22:51 | <geekosaur> | that said I can see why you'd want the compositor to be the display server; as things are in X11-land, one reason compositors tend to suck is they have to all but duplicate the X server anyway |
| 2022-03-14 18:23:23 | <geekosaur> | or take windows away from the X server and give them to e.g. OpenGL |
| 2022-03-14 18:27:02 | <Guest75> | wayland's compositor + display server seems fine to me given how X11 works, but throwing the WM into some omni-process feels weird. I need to read up to make sure I understand the justification |
| 2022-03-14 18:28:12 | <Guest75> | feels like separate concerns, but I'm not too knowledgeable on frames and buffers yet |
| 2022-03-14 18:29:28 | <geekosaur> | in some ways they are separate concerns. in others they are not, and some of the shortcomings in X11 compared to Wayland is precisely that window managers and compositors can't share the parts that are in common and can't really synchronize with each other properly |
| 2022-03-14 18:29:44 | <geekosaur> | then again, that mostly comes out when doing fancy eye candy |
| 2022-03-14 18:30:32 | <geekosaur> | but the same problems do exist in lesser forms even with normal window management, and e.g. compton/picom has several knobs to tweak to try to keep it and the window manager on the same page |
| 2022-03-14 18:31:06 | <geekosaur> | and you have to duplicate some specific-window knowledge between the window manager configuration and compton.conf |
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| 2022-03-14 19:10:19 | <twiclo1> | On other window managers if you have vimx open to a file then try to open that same file in a new terminal with vimx it will just take you to the desktop that vimx session is on. Apparently this doesn't work for a friend of mine on xmonad. Does anyone know what X function does this and if there's a fix? |
| 2022-03-14 19:12:48 | <geekosaur> | that should use EWMH's assign focus feature. it should work if EwmhDesktops is configured properly and if assign-focus hasn't been overridden (this is commonly done to stop browsers from randomly stealing focus) |
| 2022-03-14 19:16:04 | <twiclo1> | Great thanks |
| 2022-03-14 19:16:26 | <geekosaur> | we support both _NET_CURRENT_DESKTOP and _NET_ACTIVE_WINDOW messages |
| 2022-03-14 19:17:17 | <geekosaur> | it is however possiblethat vimx gets confused by the fact that we don't treat a workspace as spanning all monitors |
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| 2022-03-14 19:20:27 | <twiclo1> | Well he doesn't even have EwmhDesktops set up yet so we'll see if that fixes things |
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| 2022-03-14 19:22:26 | <twiclo1> | Can you have a shortcut for regular fullscreening of an application and another for "proper" fullscreening with ewmhFullscreen? |
| 2022-03-14 19:22:36 | <twiclo1> | Or is it an all or nothing type deal? |
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| 2022-03-14 19:25:29 | <Guest75> | Nothing is all or nothing in xmonad : ) |
| 2022-03-14 19:25:43 | <geekosaur> | I'mnot sure I understand the question. |
| 2022-03-14 19:25:49 | <Guest75> | https://old.reddit.com/r/xmonad/comments/su6tb9/how_to_not_allow_a_specific_application_to_go/hxihtgm/ |
| 2022-03-14 19:25:49 | <Guest75> | An example of how I set this up |
| 2022-03-14 19:26:20 | <geekosaur> | all I can get ut of "regular fullscreening" is using a layout which assigns a full screen rectangle to an app, like Full or Simplest |
| 2022-03-14 19:26:28 | <geekosaur> | (or almost full screen, like Tabbed) |
| 2022-03-14 19:26:44 | <Guest75> | I use an xprop to determine if a window uses the ewmhFullScreen event hook or not |
| 2022-03-14 19:27:01 | <twiclo1> | You can set up emwhFullscreen so that an application will actually take up the whole screen instead of just their container right? |
| 2022-03-14 19:27:10 | <twiclo1> | Guest75 thanks. I'll look into that |
| 2022-03-14 19:31:32 | <Solid> | twiclo1: yes, there's the separate ewmhFullscreen combinator for that |
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