Logs: liberachat/#haskell
| 2021-08-09 11:55:41 | → | derelict joins (~derelict@user/derelict) |
| 2021-08-09 11:55:59 | <tomsmeding> | unless he's ready to spend a very large amount of time to become basically an experienced software developer before getting a good job :p |
| 2021-08-09 11:56:23 | <tomsmeding> | but I can't speak from experience here, so take what I say with a grain of salt |
| 2021-08-09 11:58:08 | <timCF> | tomsmeding: there is no right answer, thanks for sharing your opinion! |
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| 2021-08-09 12:00:19 | <timCF> | I came to Haskell from Erlang, and transition was relatively easy. So simple untyped language like Erlang, Lua or Python might work for him as well. |
| 2021-08-09 12:01:16 | <timCF> | Just to get started. But this might go very wrong as well, haha. |
| 2021-08-09 12:01:18 | → | eggplantade joins (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-08-09 12:01:28 | <hpc> | i think either way an employer is going to have to be understanding of him being very new to programming |
| 2021-08-09 12:02:03 | <merijn> | otoh |
| 2021-08-09 12:02:07 | <hpc> | the difference between "knows a bit of the language the job uses, but nothing else" and "knows a bit of some other language, but nothing else" isn't that much |
| 2021-08-09 12:02:36 | → | Obo joins (~roberto@70.pool90-171-81.dynamic.orange.es) |
| 2021-08-09 12:02:37 | <hpc> | so might as well try and solve the "but nothing else" problem faster instead |
| 2021-08-09 12:03:01 | <merijn> | My girlfriend did an 8 month intense course to get a bachelor in programming and that program had her already hired before she finished (in the condition of graduating, that is) |
| 2021-08-09 12:03:35 | <merijn> | So, at least over here you can pretty easily get a job with no experience if you have even a bit of aptitude :p |
| 2021-08-09 12:04:02 | <timCF> | merijn: You said she is using Haskell? What university is this? |
| 2021-08-09 12:04:10 | <merijn> | Naah, that's unrelated :p |
| 2021-08-09 12:04:25 | <merijn> | That program was Java, because, duh :p |
| 2021-08-09 12:04:40 | <timCF> | Ah, I see. Just hoped that there are some valuable Haskell courses for beginners) |
| 2021-08-09 12:04:42 | <merijn> | But I was teaching her Haskell in the months before |
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| 2021-08-09 12:06:33 | <merijn> | timCF: It was a program started by a bunch of IT companies struggling to hire people together with some of the "university" of applied sciences (for lack of a better term) based on their 4 year bachelor program |
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| 2021-08-09 12:22:28 | → | hyiltiz joins (~quassel@31.220.5.250) |
| 2021-08-09 12:22:46 | <kuribas> | Is there a named Monad that is equivalent to (,)? |
| 2021-08-09 12:23:07 | <kuribas> | to (a,) I mean. |
| 2021-08-09 12:23:09 | <earthy> | Interesting. We set up such a program ourselves... and we do teach a bit of Haskell... |
| 2021-08-09 12:23:35 | → | cheater joins (~Username@user/cheater) |
| 2021-08-09 12:23:46 | <[exa]> | kuribas: Const and Writer are kinda similar, in ways |
| 2021-08-09 12:23:54 | <[exa]> | (random thought ^) |
| 2021-08-09 12:23:55 | <merijn> | kuribas: Eh, that's Writer :p |
| 2021-08-09 12:24:03 | <kuribas> | ah right :-) |
| 2021-08-09 12:24:14 | <earthy> | (then again, our program is 18 months, not 8, and we hire people into the program) |
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| 2021-08-09 12:25:12 | <merijn> | earthy: Well, this program has a bunch of in-take meetings and a job fair with prospective employers and you only really get to start if one of them already agreed to hire you at the start, it seems to work out fairly well |
| 2021-08-09 12:25:38 | <earthy> | sounds like a bootcamp-like program done reasonably well |
| 2021-08-09 12:25:57 | <kuribas> | no, because "WriterT [Int] Maybe" is equal to Maybe ([Int], a), not ([Int], Maybe a) |
| 2021-08-09 12:26:08 | <kuribas> | The second I am interested in... |
| 2021-08-09 12:28:15 | <earthy> | AccumT? |
| 2021-08-09 12:28:56 | <earthy> | Still not what you want. |
| 2021-08-09 12:28:59 | <merijn> | kuribas: Sounds like you just want State, tbh |
| 2021-08-09 12:29:07 | earthy | nods |
| 2021-08-09 12:29:25 | <kuribas> | > liftA2 (liftA2 (+)) ([1], Nothing) ([2::Int], Just 1) |
| 2021-08-09 12:29:27 | <lambdabot> | ([1,2],Nothing) |
| 2021-08-09 12:29:40 | <kuribas> | > liftA2 (liftA2 (+)) ([1], Just 1) ([2::Int], Just 1) |
| 2021-08-09 12:29:42 | <lambdabot> | ([1,2],Just 2) |
| 2021-08-09 12:29:47 | <kuribas> | I want this ^^ |
| 2021-08-09 12:30:28 | <[exa]> | kuribas: isn't that more like MaybeT (Writer [Int]) ? |
| 2021-08-09 12:30:58 | <kuribas> | [exa]: ah right! |
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| 2021-08-09 12:35:59 | <kuribas> | Doesn't MaybeT stops writing after Nothing? |
| 2021-08-09 12:36:06 | <kuribas> | MaybeT Writer |
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| 2021-08-09 12:37:09 | <kuribas> | That would give ([1], Nothing) then |
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| 2021-08-09 12:39:33 | <dibblego> | so does what you want ^^ |
| 2021-08-09 12:39:48 | <kuribas> | dibblego: no, I want ([1, 2], Nothing) |
| 2021-08-09 12:40:25 | <kuribas> | ah, that cannot be a Monad then... |
| 2021-08-09 12:41:26 | <dibblego> | data M a = M [Int] (Maybe a); instance Monoid M where... |
| 2021-08-09 12:41:27 | <earthy> | You want an arrow, and &&& |
| 2021-08-09 12:41:40 | <earthy> | or some such |
| 2021-08-09 12:43:28 | <kuribas> | Writer Int (Maybe a) ... |
| 2021-08-09 12:43:48 | <kuribas> | :t Const |
| 2021-08-09 12:43:49 | <lambdabot> | forall k a (b :: k). a -> Const a b |
| 2021-08-09 12:44:14 | <earthy> | Do you need it to be a monad? Can you get away with relaxing some of the laws? :) |
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| 2021-08-09 12:45:22 | <kuribas> | earthy: yeah, I cannot even be a monad, because I need to collect the errors (or warnings). |
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| 2021-08-09 12:46:19 | <merijn> | kuribas: Do you don't just want Validation? |
| 2021-08-09 12:46:49 | ← | Guest98 parts (~Guest98@31.4.136.211) () |
| 2021-08-09 12:46:49 | <merijn> | kuribas: Which is the Applicative version of Either that aggregates errors (instead of returning the first) |
| 2021-08-09 12:47:03 | <stoicswe[m]> | V |
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| 2021-08-09 12:47:22 | <kuribas> | merijn: I am parsing a csv, so I want to collect the original rows, and add an error collumn if the parsing fails. |
| 2021-08-09 12:47:37 | <merijn> | kuribas: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/either-5.0.1.1/docs/Data-Either-Validation.html |
| 2021-08-09 12:47:55 | <stoicswe[m]> | Whoops, sorry for the random ‘V’ there. I accidentally sent that. |
| 2021-08-09 12:48:12 | <earthy> | still not a monad though. ;P |
| 2021-08-09 12:48:34 | <earthy> | (and Validation is the exact use case indeed) |
| 2021-08-09 12:49:02 | <kuribas> | so I have ([originalCsv], Just parsedField) or ([addError originalCsv], Nothing) |
| 2021-08-09 12:49:18 | <merijn> | These? :p |
| 2021-08-09 12:49:29 | <merijn> | That lets you aggregate errors *and* a result :p |
| 2021-08-09 12:49:31 | <kuribas> | merijn: no, These also stops with an error. |
| 2021-08-09 12:50:09 | <merijn> | kuribas: It doesn't |
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