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2021-07-18 20:21:54 × burnsidesLlama quits (~burnsides@dhcp168-011.wadham.ox.ac.uk) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2021-07-18 20:26:44 × burnsidesLlama quits (~burnsides@dhcp168-011.wadham.ox.ac.uk) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2021-07-18 20:29:07 sm wonders why the above thread jumped tracks from LLVM to apple .. do these go together ?
2021-07-18 20:29:38 chris_ joins (~chris@81.96.113.213)
2021-07-18 20:29:43 <sm> and , #ghc is also a good source of info
2021-07-18 20:30:24 × MQ-17J quits (~MQ-17J@d14-69-206-129.try.wideopenwest.com) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2021-07-18 20:31:47 <davean> sm: it was about Apple
2021-07-18 20:31:49 <geekosaur> sm: M1 == Apple Silicon
2021-07-18 20:31:55 <davean> the point of LLVM there was to get M1 support
2021-07-18 20:32:08 <davean> which we get via LLVM or the native code gen, the native code gen isn't until 9.2 tohugh
2021-07-18 20:32:30 MQ-17J joins (~MQ-17J@d14-69-206-129.try.wideopenwest.com)
2021-07-18 20:32:35 <zangi> does laziness consume more memory than strict evaluation?
2021-07-18 20:32:42 × Topsi quits (~Tobias@dyndsl-095-033-088-035.ewe-ip-backbone.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2021-07-18 20:32:45 <davean> zangi: no, sometimes far less
2021-07-18 20:32:46 <dminuoso> Yes. No.
2021-07-18 20:33:38 Atum_ joins (~IRC@user/atum/x-2392232)
2021-07-18 20:33:40 <zangi> what about the thunks?
2021-07-18 20:33:42 <dminuoso> zangi: In order to provide lazyness, the lazy expression has to have some kind of memory representation. That costs allocation and indirection.
2021-07-18 20:33:44 <davean> zangi: Theres a few cases where it uses more, the main one is special cased in the GC
2021-07-18 20:34:07 <davean> zangi: whats smaller, the infinite list, or the thunk [1..]?
2021-07-18 20:34:11 <dminuoso> zangi: But this is usually offset having low residency when working on large data.
2021-07-18 20:34:17 jneira_ joins (~jneira_@28.red-80-28-169.staticip.rima-tde.net)
2021-07-18 20:34:33 × takuan quits (~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
2021-07-18 20:34:45 <dminuoso> I think the fundamental problem is that "memory consumption" is not something you can put as a single number metric.
2021-07-18 20:37:37 Hecate_ is now known as Hecate
2021-07-18 20:37:44 <dminuoso> For instance: Your program might process a 20TiB data set but have only 50MiB of memory residency at any given time.
2021-07-18 20:37:47 × Hecate quits (~mariposa@163.172.211.189) (Changing host)
2021-07-18 20:37:47 Hecate joins (~mariposa@user/hecate)
2021-07-18 20:38:21 × slep quits (~slep@cpc150002-brnt4-2-0-cust437.4-2.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2021-07-18 20:38:39 <dminuoso> But this could still have a lot of allocations internally
2021-07-18 20:38:52 slep joins (~slep@cpc150002-brnt4-2-0-cust437.4-2.cable.virginm.net)
2021-07-18 20:39:22 <dminuoso> Lazyness also produces a level of indirection, which might hurt locality
2021-07-18 20:39:37 × Pickchea quits (~private@user/pickchea) (Quit: Leaving)
2021-07-18 20:40:10 <davean> or it can create locality
2021-07-18 20:40:46 <lechner> Hi, why are the dolla signs needed in these two lines, please? https://dpaste.org/41S0#L94,95
2021-07-18 20:40:59 × ph88^ quits (~ph88@2a02:8109:9e00:7e5c:f938:d06a:9ad7:b39c) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2021-07-18 20:41:03 <dminuoso> lechner: They are not needed.
2021-07-18 20:41:17 <dminuoso> lechner: You can also use parens to associate the right hand side of it.
2021-07-18 20:41:31 <dminuoso> host $ scheduler config is equivalent to: host (schedular config)
2021-07-18 20:41:42 <lechner> can i use map, too?
2021-07-18 20:43:12 burnsidesLlama joins (~burnsides@dhcp168-011.wadham.ox.ac.uk)
2021-07-18 20:43:47 <lechner> dminuoso: I get the following errors when I take out the dollar signs https://dpaste.org/mM0q
2021-07-18 20:44:10 <dminuoso> lechner: Like I said.
2021-07-18 20:44:16 <dsal> Does anyone know how to do something interesting with Control.Monad.Trans.Select ? There doesn't seem to be much written about it.
2021-07-18 20:44:21 <dminuoso> `host $ scheduler config` is equivalent to `host (scheduler config)
2021-07-18 20:44:35 × renzhi quits (~xp@2607:fa49:655f:a700::8b9f) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2021-07-18 20:44:50 <lechner> okay, why are the parentheses needed, please?
2021-07-18 20:44:56 <davean> lechner: to parse it
2021-07-18 20:45:08 <geekosaur> $ is "backwards parentheses
2021-07-18 20:45:15 <lechner> that i know
2021-07-18 20:45:35 <lechner> i think it's a (slightly) higher level question
2021-07-18 20:45:39 wroathe joins (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
2021-07-18 20:45:40 <davean> lechner: so things (sorta) group to the left by default
2021-07-18 20:45:42 <geekosaur> so if you remove a $ you usually have to insert the parenheses it was replacing. here, for (scheduler config)
2021-07-18 20:45:52 <davean> lechner: you need to put it into the grammer as a group, not seperate things
2021-07-18 20:46:03 <lechner> my JSON declarations are not strict
2021-07-18 20:46:22 <davean> WHo said anything about strictness?
2021-07-18 20:46:53 <davean> This is about grammar
2021-07-18 20:47:04 <monochrom> The computer is not telepathic. You can't just write "f g h" and "t x y" and have the computer guess "oh you mean (f g) h and t (x y)".
2021-07-18 20:47:37 <lechner> not even when asking for a final result (printf) ?
2021-07-18 20:47:55 <monochrom> But there is a little bit of left associativity so "f g h" means "(f g) h".
2021-07-18 20:48:24 <lechner> why is that evaluated in my case, though?
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2021-07-18 20:48:44 × amahl quits (~amahl@dsl-jklbng12-54fbca-64.dhcp.inet.fi) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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2021-07-18 20:52:20 <nf> you usually have to evaluate things in order to print them
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2021-07-18 20:53:32 <davean> lechner: it doesn't know printf is your final result even
2021-07-18 20:53:34 × ph88^ quits (~ph88@2a02:8109:9e00:7e5c:f938:d06a:9ad7:b39c) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2021-07-18 20:53:36 <lechner> but is that done inside the parentheses around the argument to printf?
2021-07-18 20:53:44 <davean> Its not "done inside"
2021-07-18 20:53:51 <davean> you're saying what is applied to what
2021-07-18 20:54:38 <lechner> i think i misunderstood partial application
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2021-07-18 20:58:39 × geekosaur quits (~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2021-07-18 21:02:28 × lbseale quits (~lbseale@user/ep1ctetus) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2021-07-18 21:02:30 <davean> Definition is not execution
2021-07-18 21:02:52 <davean> lechner: consider the option of doign that like with (.)
2021-07-18 21:02:58 <davean> *line
2021-07-18 21:03:46 × MQ-17J quits (~MQ-17J@d14-69-206-129.try.wideopenwest.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2021-07-18 21:04:47 <maerwald> monochrom: wingman can guess what you mean, haha
2021-07-18 21:05:02 <maerwald> if your types are correct, that is
2021-07-18 21:06:36 <maerwald> now you just need something to guess the types for you
2021-07-18 21:07:16 <maerwald> and then something that guesses what the program should do
2021-07-18 21:07:26 <maerwald> we'll have no engineering problems to solve anymore
2021-07-18 21:07:43 maerwald goes packing
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2021-07-18 21:08:24 <dexterfoo> can I convert a 'Text' value directly into an Int?
2021-07-18 21:08:27 MQ-17J joins (~MQ-17J@d14-69-206-129.try.wideopenwest.com)
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2021-07-18 21:11:07 <Hecate> % import Data.Text.Read
2021-07-18 21:11:08 <yahb> Hecate:

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