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Logs: liberachat/#haskell

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2026-04-22 16:26:44 <gentauro> c_wraith: hmmmm, the syntax is very similar then
2026-04-22 16:27:10 <gentauro> however, I don't think YAML has `if-statements`
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2026-04-22 16:27:48 <c_wraith> Think of it the other way around. YAML has a *ton* of syntactic constructs that cabal doesn't support.
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2026-04-22 16:28:31 <c_wraith> If you try to treat it as YAML, you'll quickly discover it's not even close
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2026-04-22 16:35:18 <EvanR> has anyone ever heard of a FRP + cybernetics blog post or article or something
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2026-04-22 16:40:45 <gentauro> EvanR: that sound like something Elon Musk would do …
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2026-04-22 17:50:50 <monochrom> (Belated) If one wants to ban bottoms, the only two currently widely deployed ways are System F (eg Dhall) and dependent type theory (eg Agda, Lean).
2026-04-22 17:51:32 <monochrom> To be sure, I would be happy if someone found a third way much more ergonomic than those two.
2026-04-22 17:52:06 <monochrom> For now, IMO banning bottoms is just a lot of high-horse unpragmatic talk.
2026-04-22 17:52:49 <monochrom> (unless the talker actually advocates going all out for those two)
2026-04-22 17:53:51 <int-e> monochrom: if it can implement the Ackermann function, is it really terminating ;)
2026-04-22 17:54:23 <monochrom> Yeah my thesis supervisor is like "termination is uninformative" because of that.
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2026-04-22 18:01:22 <monochrom> When I took a compiler course, I submitted as a test case the Ackermann function! (The prof gave bonus marks for supporting recursion.)
2026-04-22 18:02:35 <monochrom> (When I took a compiler course and submitted its toy compiler project)
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2026-04-22 18:30:03 ski . o O ( "Higher-Order Recursion Abstraction: How to Make Ackermann, Knuth and Conway Look Like a Bunch of Primitives, Figuratively Speaking" by Baltasar Trancón y Widemann in 2018-09-17 at <https://arxiv.org/abs/1602.05010> )
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2026-04-22 18:35:39 <gentauro> monochrom: can you ban `bottom` with Liquid Haskell comments?
2026-04-22 18:36:03 <monochrom> I guess yes.
2026-04-22 18:36:32 <monochrom> But I have a feeling that Liquid Haskell is even less widely used than Lean.
2026-04-22 18:38:38 <gentauro> I tried to use it, couldn't make it build (nightly though)
2026-04-22 18:38:44 <gentauro> must try again I guess
2026-04-22 18:41:25 <monochrom> Personally I just fight bottom mistakes with test cases. This is more powerful in Haskell than in many other languages. Due to parametricity, if a sufficiently polymorphic function terminates for one test, then it terminates for a large generality.
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2026-04-22 20:28:57 <EvanR> monochrom, also HTML has no bottoms
2026-04-22 20:29:04 <EvanR> it's widely deployed
2026-04-22 20:29:45 <EvanR> though I now see my old suggestion to add "functions" to HTML would then need some dhall sauce or lean sauce to not ruin that
2026-04-22 20:30:27 <EvanR> or homotopy type theory sauce
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