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Logs: liberachat/#haskell

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2021-06-15 19:11:02 × fabfianda[m] quits (~fabfianda@2001:470:69fc:105::6db) (Quit: Client limit exceeded: 10000)
2021-06-15 19:11:19 eggplantade joins (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:bef1:5e10:b9b1:9fc2:289f:a533)
2021-06-15 19:11:29 <cdsmith> <janus "how is Typeable different from G"> Typeable lets you compare types. Generic lets you look at the structure of a data type: which constructors it has, what their fields are, etc.
2021-06-15 19:12:01 × ec quits (~ec@gateway/tor-sasl/ec) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2021-06-15 19:12:05 <janus> ah right, i can see how those are distinct and why Aeson would only require Generic to make an automatic ToJSON instance
2021-06-15 19:12:23 <janus> what is a popular use case for Typeable?
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2021-06-15 19:13:06 <monochrom> f x = "if x :: Int then True else False"
2021-06-15 19:13:27 <monochrom> basically the dream of every fan of dynamic typing.
2021-06-15 19:13:35 <janus> oh no, it's horrible! :O
2021-06-15 19:13:58 <ordinate> haskell is an interpreted, dynamically typed language
2021-06-15 19:17:22 <monochrom> @quote monochrom runtime
2021-06-15 19:17:22 <lambdabot> monochrom says: just add #! /usr/bin/runghc to your haskell file. then type errors occur at runtime only.
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2021-06-15 19:18:50 <janus> most people expect them to be deferred too, though ;)
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2021-06-15 19:20:21 <janus> was it outrageous when dynamic languages started adding ASTs so they wouldn't even start executing with SyntaxErrors? an extreme dynamic fan should be offended, surely ;P
2021-06-15 19:20:50 vaibhavsagar[m] joins (~vaibhavsa@2001:470:69fc:105::ffe)
2021-06-15 19:21:27 <monochrom> or Haskell resisting dependent typing so static fans are offended that head :: [a] -> a exists.
2021-06-15 19:21:49 LukeHoersten joins (~LukeHoers@user/lukehoersten)
2021-06-15 19:22:18 <tomsmeding> that quote should have -fdeferred-type-errors too
2021-06-15 19:22:36 <dolio> It's probably older than that flag.
2021-06-15 19:23:00 <tomsmeding> and also having flags in a shebang is probably not a good idea :)
2021-06-15 19:24:30 <janus> tomsmeding: many BSD'ers recommend "#!/usr/bin/env bash". why would a flag be different from "bash" here? to the shell it is the same, surely?
2021-06-15 19:24:55 <janus> (ok, i know, an extreme BSD'er wouldn't even accept using bash ;)
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2021-06-15 19:27:30 <monochrom> No worries, "#!/usr/bin/env python3" is a thing too.
2021-06-15 19:27:51 <maerwald> not sure '/usr/bin/env' is really specified by posix either
2021-06-15 19:28:08 × carmysilna quits (~brightly-@2001:470:69fc:105::2190) (Quit: Client limit exceeded: 10000)
2021-06-15 19:28:09 <janus> right, AFAIK the trouble starts when you want both: the executable whereever in the path, AND some command line params
2021-06-15 19:28:20 <maerwald> I think they recommend hardcoding full absolute paths to the binary at "install time" by using getconf
2021-06-15 19:28:24 <tomsmeding> janus: https://stackoverflow.com/a/4304187
2021-06-15 19:28:37 <tomsmeding> on many systems, you can pass at most one parameter in a shebang line
2021-06-15 19:28:45 <tomsmeding> though I guess that is enough for the runghc thing :)
2021-06-15 19:29:04 carmysilna joins (~brightly-@2001:470:69fc:105::2190)
2021-06-15 19:29:08 <tomsmeding> maerwald: see link, #! isn't even specified :p
2021-06-15 19:29:28 <tomsmeding> env has -S but it's dangerous
2021-06-15 19:29:35 wroathe joins (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
2021-06-15 19:29:47 <janus> ooh, so there is a motivation for providing an argument passing mode that requires only one argv entry for all the arguments. interesting!
2021-06-15 19:29:49 <maerwald> but these are 1st world problems... if you've ever done powershell, you know it can be *way* worse
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2021-06-15 19:30:34 <janus> i stick to the C subset of windows to piss of microsoft programmers that will have to maintain it for 200 years muahahaha
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2021-06-15 19:33:25 <monochrom> linux manpage for execve says "the entire string after the interpreter name is a single argument. some other systems split it into multiple arguments by spaces"
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2021-06-15 19:38:15 <tomsmeding> monochrom: indeed, linux implements behaviour 3 from the linked SO answer
2021-06-15 19:38:40 ddellacosta joins (~ddellacos@86.106.121.100)
2021-06-15 19:38:41 tomsmeding is trying to be inclusive towards non-linux systems, let me
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2021-06-15 20:03:46 <dminuoso> cdsmith: Out of curiosity, what IRC client are you using? Your quoting/response style looks very unfamiliar.
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2021-06-15 20:04:44 <geekosaur> that's a form that matrix can use
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2021-06-15 20:05:33 <dminuoso> Ah
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2021-06-15 20:09:32 <dminuoso> janus: By the way, you asked about a good use of Typeable. The best and most common usage I can think of is exceptions, especially extensible dynamically-typed hierarchies of extensions. That last one is probably very underused on hackage.
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2021-06-15 20:10:34 <dminuoso> `catch` fundamentally relies on Typeable to be able to check whether a bypassing exception matches the requested exception type or not.
2021-06-15 20:10:46 merijn joins (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl)
2021-06-15 20:10:59 <janus> oh, so you're saying i can make an exception that lets itself be treated as an exception that never existed when the code catching it was written?

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