Logs: freenode/#haskell
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| 2021-03-18 05:17:17 | <DigitalKiwi> | or worse: someone else getting a blue ribbon and you thinking it's worth that |
| 2021-03-18 05:18:24 | <DigitalKiwi> | ...a picture of it lol |
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| 2021-03-18 05:21:11 | <DigitalKiwi> | https://mashable.com/article/nft-cryptocurrency-bad-environment-art/ was the first thing i read about them a few days ago lol |
| 2021-03-18 05:21:46 | <Axman6> | proof of work is the real evil, it's very anti-lazy |
| 2021-03-18 05:22:15 | <DigitalKiwi> | that's why i'm a commie |
| 2021-03-18 05:23:20 | <Axman6> | this is one of the reasons I don't get all the hate for Cardano, there are still problems with it, but at least it's not trying to boil the oceans as fast as possible |
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| 2021-03-18 05:25:35 | <Cale> | Distributed databases are just not the solution to very many real-world problems |
| 2021-03-18 05:27:00 | <Cale> | If you sort out the stuff that would be necessary to connect your database to the real world, the socio-political part of any given problem, then usually a centralised database almost immediately suffices, because in so doing you needed to give people some kind of authority, and those people might as well run the database. |
| 2021-03-18 05:27:45 | <Axman6> | working on DAML has made me rethink that idea |
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| 2021-03-18 05:28:28 | <Cale> | After all, the people who are responsible for enforcing things in the real world are going to be able to act as though the contents of the database are different from what they really are, so that administration might as well have the authority to edit anything as it sees fit. |
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| 2021-03-18 05:29:42 | <Cale> | (Obviously, not every member of it should be abusing that power all the time, but overall, it's often going to be necessary that the organisation itself agree that the contents of the database are in fact incorrect or invalid.) |
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| 2021-03-18 05:31:55 | <DigitalKiwi> | https://mostlyabsurd.com/files/stonks!.png s/stonks/crypto/ |
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| 2021-03-18 05:34:25 | <DigitalKiwi> | or even better: stonks that track crypto trends :) |
| 2021-03-18 05:34:50 | <slack1256> | I am this close of work on NFT company ;_; . |
| 2021-03-18 05:35:01 | <slack1256> | working* |
| 2021-03-18 05:35:32 | <DigitalKiwi> | MARA went up 12.57% yesterday lol |
| 2021-03-18 05:35:56 | <DigitalKiwi> | RIOT 13.62% |
| 2021-03-18 05:36:33 | <DigitalKiwi> | CAN 11.57% |
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| 2021-03-18 05:46:24 | <Axman6> | Cale: at ${CURRENT_JOB-2}, we were working on a system for managing and tracing events in supply chains, which obviously requires the interaction of many parties, with parties having a desire to maintain ownership of their data. If I'd known about DAML at the time we could have modelled basically all the requirements we had "trivially", including providing visibility to trusted third parties to observe events throughout the supplychain. I'll |
| 2021-03-18 05:46:24 | <Axman6> | admit it is probably one of the few places hwere this really could be useful, but they do exist |
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| 2021-03-18 05:50:10 | <Cale> | How is DAML fundamentally any better than each of those parties running postgres databases (perhaps with a similar API), given that it's possible to do authenticated communication with them via the Internet? |
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| 2021-03-18 05:50:22 | <DigitalKiwi> | one of my dad's (long time ago former) clients started one of those a few years ago i think |
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| 2021-03-18 05:51:14 | <Axman6> | because that's exactly what it gives you, but visibility of information is a core concept in the language, so you have to eplicitly expose information to other parties, rather than working to hide it |
| 2021-03-18 05:51:47 | <Axman6> | (One of the DAML backends it literally just Postgres, no blockchain) |
| 2021-03-18 05:51:56 | <Cale> | Well, that's fair |
| 2021-03-18 05:52:07 | <Cale> | The thing I think is useless here is blockchains |
| 2021-03-18 05:52:09 | <Axman6> | ((I also can't claim to be an expert on DAML, I just write it )) |
| 2021-03-18 05:54:37 | <DigitalKiwi> | whatcha got against merkle trees |
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| 2021-03-18 05:56:39 | <Axman6> | yeah DAML is the contract language, which has several backends (and using DAML Connect [I think, its name changed], you can use DAML to write contracts which exist on and are executed on different blockchains) |
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| 2021-03-18 05:58:57 | <Axman6> | uh, Canton is what I meant |
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| 2021-03-18 06:02:36 | <Cale> | DigitalKiwi: Well, it's not so much Merkle trees themselves, but the notion of having a distributed database with non-cooperative or adversarial writers that I think is bad, and once people are cooperating, you can centralise a database and make it way more efficient. |
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| 2021-03-18 06:12:17 | <Axman6> | https://daml.com/learn/fundamental-concepts (IIRC) does a good job of explaining the authorisation model for the language, you need to be quite explicit about what actions any given party can do, and which parties need to be involved/give consent |
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| 2021-03-18 06:12:57 | Axman6 | wishes he had flip in the shell |
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| 2021-03-18 06:13:35 | <CodeKiwi> | Axman6: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/flip-cmd |
| 2021-03-18 06:13:38 | <Cale> | Yeah, *that* kind of thing I think is fine. I just don't see why a blockchain or distributed storage (apart perhaps from replication) needs to be any part of it in almost all cases. |
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| 2021-03-18 06:15:34 | <CodeKiwi> | Cale: all you have is a hammer... |
| 2021-03-18 06:15:41 | <CodeKiwi> | Cale: when* all you have is a hammer... |
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| 2021-03-18 06:16:28 | <Axman6> | CodeKiwi: Hmm, what I really want is flip (||) (print "\a") $ somethingWhichMightFail # things in comments are iportant for my shell history |
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