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2021-04-28 07:29:19 × ericsagn1 quits (~ericsagne@2405:6580:0:5100:4233:4fa2:ecc4:e3d1) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2021-04-28 07:29:24 <letmein> if it were, then haskell wouldn't be turing complete, assuming i understand the question correctly
2021-04-28 07:29:47 <maerwald> ?
2021-04-28 07:30:06 <maerwald> expressing totality /= everything must be total
2021-04-28 07:30:23 <olle> Right
2021-04-28 07:30:25 <olle> opqdonut: thanks
2021-04-28 07:30:35 fendor joins (~fendor@178.165.130.176.wireless.dyn.drei.com)
2021-04-28 07:30:38 <maerwald> F* can express totality
2021-04-28 07:30:45 <olle> As can Koka, in fact.
2021-04-28 07:30:53 <maerwald> liquidhaskell too
2021-04-28 07:31:05 <letmein> ah ok. my bad
2021-04-28 07:31:07 <maerwald> to some degree I think
2021-04-28 07:32:16 × zmijunkie quits (~Adium@109.90.32.89) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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2021-04-28 07:33:48 cfricke joins (~cfricke@unaffiliated/cfricke)
2021-04-28 07:34:32 <olle> Is there another word for "weak" totality, when it's guaranteed to act on all of the domain?
2021-04-28 07:34:40 <olle> E.g. not missing a case
2021-04-28 07:34:54 lordyod joins (~lordyod@c-67-169-144-132.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2021-04-28 07:35:13 <opqdonut> isn't that just totality? at least if "to act on" means "to terminate"
2021-04-28 07:35:21 <opqdonut> or what do you mean?
2021-04-28 07:36:27 hiroaki joins (~hiroaki@2a02:8108:8c40:2bb8:a736:199e:991f:4edb)
2021-04-28 07:37:12 <olle> opqdonut: You can have a function that acts on all cases, but one case throws an exception --> no totality
2021-04-28 07:37:58 <opqdonut> how's that different from a non-total function that throws an exception on one case?
2021-04-28 07:38:22 <opqdonut> or perhaps you mean something like "guaranteed to terminate with a value or an exception"
2021-04-28 07:38:32 <opqdonut> that's perhaps even harder to track in a compiler than normal totality
2021-04-28 07:38:49 <olle> Instead of totality, something like "no case missed"
2021-04-28 07:39:10 <opqdonut> what I'm trying to say is how can you distinguish a "missed case" from some other reason for nontotality?
2021-04-28 07:39:18 <opqdonut> arguably every nontotal function merely "misses a case"
2021-04-28 07:39:21 <olle> Good question
2021-04-28 07:40:16 jgt joins (~jgt@95.12.112.152)
2021-04-28 07:41:01 × stree quits (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2021-04-28 07:41:16 ericsagn1 joins (~ericsagne@2405:6580:0:5100:b546:5594:c630:5696)
2021-04-28 07:41:52 ddellacosta joins (ddellacost@gateway/vpn/mullvad/ddellacosta)
2021-04-28 07:41:53 <maerwald> GHC warns you if you're not matching on a value
2021-04-28 07:42:23 <maerwald> that says nothing about whether the function terminates
2021-04-28 07:42:42 <opqdonut> yeah, and it's only a local check
2021-04-28 07:42:55 <opqdonut> calling head doesn't generate a warning :)
2021-04-28 07:43:13 <curiousgay> I need help identifying which part of code for boggle https://pastebin.com/raw/yxC9Wvzm is really slow, I was sure lazy evaluation would take care of that (that terrible naming of findWord is not mine)
2021-04-28 07:45:18 <olle> maerwald: right, you have this check.
2021-04-28 07:45:58 <olle> maerwald: what do you call it? exhaustiveness?
2021-04-28 07:46:06 <olle> so maybe that's the word to use, not "totality"
2021-04-28 07:46:13 <curiousgay> I should be more concrete that's just the code for checking whether the word is on board or not
2021-04-28 07:46:39 × ddellacosta quits (ddellacost@gateway/vpn/mullvad/ddellacosta) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2021-04-28 07:48:22 <curiousgay> maybe I'll solve that myself after taking a sleep...
2021-04-28 07:48:29 × cgfbee quits (~bot@oc1.itim-cj.ro) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2021-04-28 07:51:11 <maerwald> olle: yes, exhaustiveness
2021-04-28 07:51:58 <olle> So you can say a function is exhaustive on its input...? Or is that weird wording?
2021-04-28 07:52:05 <olle> Instead of total.
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2021-04-28 08:11:19 × letmein quits (~letmein@2601:1c1:4200:938f:f8bf:6a67:4eed:b2c1) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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2021-04-28 08:13:45 <hc> exhaustive is the proper term for it, I think
2021-04-28 08:14:02 <nshepperd2> i think exhaustiveness is more a property of source code than functions
2021-04-28 08:14:32 kini joins (~kini@unaffiliated/kini)
2021-04-28 08:15:49 <nshepperd2> if you have a function that has one case defined as 'undefined' that's semantically the same as a function with the case left out, it just indicates that the programmer did it on purpose
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