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2021-07-29 17:40:17 × curiousgay quits (~curiousga@77-120-186-48.kha.volia.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2021-07-29 17:40:20 <motle> just for streaming i think, but they can output back into themselves, so i think thats how it does recursion too
2021-07-29 17:41:04 <motle> eg you could just provide initial data and have it unfold data streamingly
2021-07-29 17:41:47 <motle> or you could also stream data into it while it runs, in sync with the clock of the internal programs evaluation scheduling as specified on the graph as a bunch of simultanious opperations per cycle
2021-07-29 17:42:42 <motle> i mean, its all just streaming through graphs for recursive programs
2021-07-29 17:43:03 <motle> (with hopfiled nets as a type restriction!)
2021-07-29 17:43:58 × burnsidesLlama quits (~burnsides@dhcp168-019.wadham.ox.ac.uk) (Remote host closed the connection)
2021-07-29 17:44:15 <motle> not sure if its wrong (or realistic) to ask for help, but anyway... thats what it is
2021-07-29 17:45:12 <lechner> Clint: thanks! i was already looking into Data.ByteString.Lazy.UTF8.fromString but your solution is much better!
2021-07-29 17:45:22 Atum_ joins (~IRC@user/atum/x-2392232)
2021-07-29 17:47:05 eggplantade joins (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2021-07-29 17:47:54 <motle> sorry i was confusing the state which does the unfold to the states on the nodes of the graph scanning over it
2021-07-29 17:48:50 <motle> thats why theres the clock function which just streams a list of (), to have a small shaped state fo the unfolding state and the rest of the unfold as a graph program scanning over the stream of ()
2021-07-29 17:49:16 roboguy_ joins (~roboguy_@2605:a601:afe7:9f00:1557:b33d:ca8c:dfa4)
2021-07-29 17:49:28 <Drew[m]> <motle> "not sure if its wrong (or..." <- I feel like I wouldn't expect many people to be able to follow your thoughts to know how to help. Clearly you've been thinking about it a lot but I think you'd need to condense it down to a more concrete question or series of questions.
2021-07-29 17:49:48 <motle> i mean n terms of getting something implemented
2021-07-29 17:50:15 <Drew[m]> What do
2021-07-29 17:50:17 <Drew[m]> oops
2021-07-29 17:50:23 <Drew[m]> What do you want to implement?
2021-07-29 17:50:34 × fossdd quits (~fossdd@sourcehut/user/fossdd) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2021-07-29 17:50:58 × azeem quits (~azeem@dynamic-adsl-94-34-48-122.clienti.tiscali.it) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2021-07-29 17:51:15 × lavaman quits (~lavaman@98.38.249.169) (Remote host closed the connection)
2021-07-29 17:51:22 <motle> i guess if i could implement a square grid as a cycle for the data in a covnet and express the net as a fold through layers that are graphs... something like that, it uses the convolutions to do both message parsing and data processing then
2021-07-29 17:51:42 fossdd joins (~fossdd@sourcehut/user/fossdd)
2021-07-29 17:51:59 <motle> but that the same structure (the aim of the implementation) be used for both, the graph with the stencil api
2021-07-29 17:52:29 <motle> the hetrogenaity and polymorphicity are difficult
2021-07-29 17:53:08 <motle> ends up with type level programs specifying the shape and for the indexing etc
2021-07-29 17:53:29 azeem joins (~azeem@176.201.11.200)
2021-07-29 17:53:45 <zzz> do imported but not used modules contribute to binary size? and i can ask the same for functions inside and outside those modules
2021-07-29 17:53:52 <motle> i guess the strange thing about passing types over the edges is thinking that they could modify the types at the nodes
2021-07-29 17:54:21 <lechner> Hi, why does Haskell always assume that with f g x i mean f(g, x) instead of f(g( x )) ?
2021-07-29 17:54:24 <zzz> s/those/any
2021-07-29 17:54:28 <motle> ie the types of the functions held in the program, a wierd result of the thing being modifiable i guess
2021-07-29 17:54:34 wroathe joins (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
2021-07-29 17:54:49 <motle> really wants to be used for genetic programming though
2021-07-29 17:55:01 <zzz> lechner: f g x === (f g) x
2021-07-29 17:55:17 <motle> have a pottential project there with elucidating slightly less common higher order programing patters
2021-07-29 17:55:25 <zzz> prefix function notation is left associative by default
2021-07-29 17:55:55 <motle> just cool to have a program that can be modifying itself while it runs i guess
2021-07-29 17:56:03 <lechner> zzz: somehow that goes against my RPN pbrain
2021-07-29 17:56:06 <motle> not sure how to handle runtime typechecking though...
2021-07-29 17:56:35 <zzz> lechner: use `f $ g $ x` then
2021-07-29 17:56:50 <motle> which would correspond to establishing or removing edges i guess, or changing types of arguments, such as the dimension of subgraph segment they were passing for insertion somewhere or something like that
2021-07-29 17:57:20 <lechner> zzz: maybe the other way woudn't work. it just seems i need a lot of brackets
2021-07-29 17:57:26 <lechner> or $
2021-07-29 17:57:27 <roboguy_> lechner: wouldn't RPN be x f g?
2021-07-29 17:58:04 <lechner> roboguy_: you are right
2021-07-29 17:58:17 <lechner> not sure what i am saying
2021-07-29 17:58:20 <zzz> :t (&)
2021-07-29 17:58:22 <lambdabot> a -> (a -> b) -> b
2021-07-29 17:58:33 <zzz> & = flip ($)
2021-07-29 17:59:40 <motle> i guess its more difficult than a regular machine learning problem. you cant just compare its outputing a stream of functions - you would want to "regularize" it directly, which would be complicated programs acting on the various types in the graph program, to try to get it to produce eg higher order functions in some order
2021-07-29 17:59:59 <lechner> it just seems there are more functions with just one argument
2021-07-29 18:00:03 <roboguy_> lechner: I don't think eta-reduction would work normally if "f g x" meant "f (g x)"
2021-07-29 18:00:12 <lechner> i ynow
2021-07-29 18:00:15 <lechner> know
2021-07-29 18:00:29 <lechner> what is eta please?
2021-07-29 18:00:37 <motle> like its not exactly straitforwards how to encourage a program to assemble itself in such a way
2021-07-29 18:01:14 <roboguy_> lechner: for example, eta-reduction allows you to rewrite "f x = g 2 x" as "f = g 2"
2021-07-29 18:01:56 <roboguy_> eta-expansion is the other direction, which is also fine
2021-07-29 18:02:08 <motle> i guess if it had some really badass way of examining the functions it was supposed to be reproducing, it could kind of make a way to produce them properly
2021-07-29 18:02:10 <roboguy_> (if the function takes enough arguments)
2021-07-29 18:02:25 <lechner> motle: don't lose those thoughts; write them into a word processor instead
2021-07-29 18:02:42 <motle> that wont make them real like you!
2021-07-29 18:02:58 <lechner> paper is real
2021-07-29 18:02:58 × azeem quits (~azeem@176.201.11.200) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2021-07-29 18:03:12 <motle> why you want to limit the audience so?
2021-07-29 18:03:23 <motle> i mean really impactful i guess
2021-07-29 18:03:28 merijn joins (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl)
2021-07-29 18:03:31 <motle> more real
2021-07-29 18:03:44 <motle> no pressure
2021-07-29 18:04:02 <lechner> on the contrary, i want to make sure your thoughts (ultimately) get the attention they deserve
2021-07-29 18:04:12 azeem joins (~azeem@dynamic-adsl-94-34-48-122.clienti.tiscali.it)
2021-07-29 18:04:34 <motle> anyway dont we have tunes still here?
2021-07-29 18:05:17 <motle> lechner: well i heard about the machine learning problem in my first hear classes so i guess similar projects have *some* attention?
2021-07-29 18:05:26 Obo joins (~roberto@70.pool90-171-81.dynamic.orange.es)
2021-07-29 18:05:31 <motle> probably makes more sense now though...
2021-07-29 18:05:44 <motle> not sure how much anyone exept me ever heard of those classes anyway
2021-07-29 18:06:18 <motle> anyway, i feel like saying something
2021-07-29 18:06:31 <motle> the point is im not sure i can write it!
2021-07-29 18:06:42 <motle> this is the barrier, for the asking for help
2021-07-29 18:06:45 <lechner> roboguy_: yeah i knew something would be off. maybe applying functions partially also breaks
2021-07-29 18:07:06 <lechner> roboguy_: don't listen to me. i am new
2021-07-29 18:07:15 <motle> anyway, machine learning problem asside, this graph at the language seems resounding
2021-07-29 18:07:37 <roboguy_> lechner: no worries! We were all new at some point!
2021-07-29 18:07:37 <motle> like enough to not just be a total waste of time for anyone to bother with
2021-07-29 18:08:00 <roboguy_> motle: are you saying that you want to parse something using a neural network?
2021-07-29 18:08:17 <motle> thats more of a use case for sake of example
2021-07-29 18:08:30 <motle> the thing is like a net with type abstraction everywhere
2021-07-29 18:08:42 <motle> ends up like a program representation
2021-07-29 18:08:49 <motle> wierdly dynamic
2021-07-29 18:08:52 <lechner> roboguy_: i love haskell though. where can i get my tattoo :)
2021-07-29 18:09:12 × superstar64 quits (~superstar@2600:1700:ed80:50a0:d250:99ff:fe2c:53c4) (Quit: Leaving)
2021-07-29 18:09:28 <motle> just for the graph really, it uses the stencil convolution for data and program evaluation ordering
2021-07-29 18:09:35 <roboguy_> lechner: haha, not sure!
2021-07-29 18:10:10 × mikoto-chan quits (~mikoto-ch@ip-193-121-10-50.dsl.scarlet.be) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2021-07-29 18:10:21 <lechner> roboguy_: it would be a giant "λ" !
2021-07-29 18:10:24 <roboguy_> motle: hmm, how familiar are you with traditional ways to implement those things?
2021-07-29 18:10:34 <motle> this is why that example
2021-07-29 18:10:44 <motle> graph, pointer, stencil? (classes)

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